New member, first 1941 johnson rifle

[TerentiusJ 0]

Hello guys, thanks the moderator create the account for me. This is Terentius from East Lansing, Michigan. I recently acquire my first johnson m1941 in an accident fun bid. It is not perfect one, it is a sporting m1941. Showing on ArtR's March 4th monitoring. sn4256 is the one I accidentally get. I'd like to ask for some research help. I haven't stripped it to see internal serial number yet. Will update when I do it. Before join in the this forum, I have read many old post about looking for proper military pattern stock or purchase a reproduction one. From my undstanding, this one has been reblued and sanded/ redo the furnitures. The receiver numbers and marking are very faded. I'd like to hear anything from you. Thanks

 

 

[tinsoldier 0]

Nice Looking rifle, it's been sporterized, BUT it retains the front sight and bayonet lug, two of the more difficult parts to find if you need them.

Being a no letter prefix gun, ArtR can give you info on what numbered parts were in it when it left the factory.  Congratulations and welcome aboard!

[ArtR 0]

Hi TerentiusJ and welcome to the forum.

From your post, you seem to have done your homework and you seem to have obtained a decent sporter for a really decent price. Good job!

From your early photos, it appears pretty much a 'military' rifle configuration with a really nice condition sporter stock. Many are not so lucky as to have a barrel with bayonet lug and proper front sight, or not have other expensive changes. While you could try to find an original or aftermarket military stock, I do not think that a major concern. Enjoy what you have.

The following information is provided from the production logs:

Receiver SN 4256, Received From: Cranston Arms, Date Received 1/8/1942, Stock No. none, Barrel No. 2814E, Hammer Block No. 3613, Hammer No. 7451, Bolt No.  8556, Locking Cam No. 4444, Firing Pin No. 9974,  Extractor No. 2862,  Magazine No. A1394, Disposition Date 1/12/1942, Transferred to J.A. Inc - N.P.C

Without proper and reliable provenance, be very careful about claims of both ownership and usage.

Also, if you would like forum members to comment about the condition of your rifle, please post high definition, quality photos showing all rifle views, and any suspected defects. Generally, photos taken with cell phones or quality cameras produce large files. If you crop the photos to the rifle in general, and scale the photos so the size is less than 2MB, uploading should work well, and the resulting photos will give reviewers enough detail to comment.

ArtR

[ArtR 0]

Hi TerentiusJ:

I just looked again at the listing and photo, and seller has it listed as SN 4258 and I think I am inclined to believe that as the numeral 6 will normally have a 'tail' on the left side, even if the upper portion is cut off. See image

As the SN probably is different, here is the corrected data for SN 4258

The following information is provided from the production logs:

Receiver SN 4258, Received From: Cranston Arms, Date Received 1/8/1942, Stock No. none, Barrel No. 1934A, Hammer Block No. 5551, Hammer No. 7089, Bolt No.  8602, Locking Cam No. 5836, Firing Pin No. 5342,  Extractor No. 4061,  Magazine No. 7786, Disposition Date 1/19/1942, Transferred to J.A. Inc - N.P.C

[TerentiusJ 0]

Hi ArtR,

I check at daylight. You are right, it is a number 8 instead of 6. The number is round up on both side, which should be 8. Thanks for you update. I am currently take it part and get picture to compress. Will give an update soon. I am glad to share more with everyone in here.

[TerentiusJ 0]

Here are some update pictures. The parts overall a mix batch fron unserialized lot to prefix lot.

The surface has been polished and reblued. overall parts at good condition. Stock is pretty solid, but unfortunately sportrized.

Both extractor and charing handle has some pattern of polishing. There is no serial number on the extractor.

Also there are few pictures less than 2MB failed to upload. Showing " There was a problem processing the uploaded file. -200 "

[ArtR 0]

TerentiusJ: The fact that the parts do not match any of the factory list is not of concern at all, as this is a "sporter" rifle that was assembled by one of the iterations of Winfield. The fact that you have all parts for a "full military" except for the butt stock is to your benefit. If you should ever locate either a butt stock or full stock set, that would allow you to basically transition to a full military rifle. Regardless, you should be very happy with your purchase as it currently exists. If you are unsure, possibly have a competent gunsmith look the rifle over. However, if your chosen gunsmith knows little to nothing of JSAR's, I would be a bit cautious. Checking headspace would be the one major concern. Other than that, others may chime in, I would think you would be good to go for a test firing.

[camstuff 0]

I think I see something possibly wrong with the firing pin spring.  It could be installed backwards.  I think I see the tail of the spring, when it should be the other direction. It should extend into the crimped washer. Mine are also bent over so they don’t slide off. 

[WHIG 0]

If you do test fire this great rifle, I would remind you to have military ammunition that has the harder military primers. Hunting .30-06 ammunition, or reloads that have normal large rifle primers, have the possibility of allowing slam fires. I have had this happen in my JSAR. Just be cautious and enjoy your new treasure!

[TerentiusJ 0]

  

22 hours ago, ArtR said:

TerentiusJ: The fact that the parts do not match any of the factory list is not of concern at all, as this is a "sporter" rifle that was assembled by one of the iterations of Winfield. The fact that you have all parts for a "full military" except for the butt stock is to your benefit. If you should ever locate either a butt stock or full stock set, that would allow you to basically transition to a full military rifle. Regardless, you should be very happy with your purchase as it currently exists. If you are unsure, possibly have a competent gunsmith look the rifle over. However, if your chosen gunsmith knows little to nothing of JSAR's, I would be a bit cautious. Checking headspace would be the one major concern. Other than that, others may chime in, I would think you would be good to go for a test firing.

Thank you ArtR, that what I think as well. It is a dealer assembled johnson automatic. I have contacted with Murray's gunstock about potential JSAR stock production. It will be a interesting journey to restore it.

[camstuff 0]

 

On 4/16/2024 at 9:51 AM, TerentiusJ said:

  

Thank you ArtR, that what I think as well. It is a dealer assembled johnson automatic. I have contacted with Murray's gunstock about potential JSAR stock production. It will be a interesting journey to restore it.

I remember some people having issues with Murray.  I would advise doing some search’s for Murry or Murray’s stocks just to read up on what you might encounter. 

[tinsoldier 0]

1 hour ago, camstuff said:

I remember some people having issues with Murray.  I would advise doing some search’s for Murry or Murray’s stocks just to read up on what you might encounter. 

Yes, this is true - I got an NRA sporter stock from him that I was not happy with.  A good friend sent him some JSAR samples and metal with the intent of Murray producing repro wood.  Much time elapsed before Murray returned the samples stating that it couldn't be done.

[eb in oregon 0]

I'd leave it alone unless you simply have to "restore" it. However it will never be original regardless the funds you spend on it and I'm betting you'll never recoup the expense if you decide to sell it.

[tsmgguy 0]

17 hours ago, tinsoldier said:

Yes, this is true - I got an NRA sporter stock from him that I was not happy with.  A good friend sent him some JSAR samples and metal with the intent of Murray producing repro wood.  Much time elapsed before Murray returned the samples stating that it couldn't be done.

Yeah, I ordered a repro M1941 butt stock from Murray's. He sent a beautiful piece of wood that had the correct exterior dimensions. It was not inletted and was therefore useless as I lack the skills necessary to complete the job. Murray explained that he didn't have an original stock to use as a template. A full refund was eventually made, but I never did figure out the object of that exercise. I was out shipping in both directions.

[Rarecat 0]

Unfortunately I too would recommend not placing any hope of Murrays delivering.  A friend of mine sent a receiver and trigger group at their request.  A year went by and my friend finally got his JSAR parts back but not stock.  The story was (at that time) that the Murray guy needed someone to bore the spring tube correctly and he couldn't do it.  

[tinsoldier 0]

32 minutes ago, Rarecat said:

Unfortunately I too would recommend not placing any hope of Murrays delivering.  A friend of mine sent a receiver and trigger group at their request.  A year went by and my friend finally got his JSAR parts back but not stock.  The story was (at that time) that the Murray guy needed someone to bore the spring tube correctly and he couldn't do it.  

We have the same friend.