tsmgguy

Just a few pics of a gun that I've owned for almost thirty years now. It has almost all of its original finish and a mirror bore. The butt stock was heavily damaged along the comb, so the stock is a John Darling reproduction. Remember him? The stock looks the part as the grain has stood up with time. The sling and bayonet scabbard are repros, but the bayonet is original.

...after field stripping. Hello, Went to reassemble as normal after field strip and the extractor fell into the rotary magazine. No problem getting it out, but when I slid the bolt back into the receiver, the bolt jammed in a forward position and will not budge except to move slightly forward and backward. It seems to be jammed just forward of where it would be in battery. Gentle tapping with a mallet and wooden dowel gets no movement. The bolt cannot be drawn out of the receiver. Insights appreciated! Thanks! Update: No problem! The bolt was hanging up on the ejector.

Thanks!

Hello, all, Is there any way to tell whether the buffer assembly is present in my assembled M1941 rifle? I'd like to avoid taking the end cap off of the recoil spring tube to check. I notice that if I remove the butt plate and stick a piece of stiff wire in the hole in the center of the plug, the wire goes in and stops after a couple of inches or so. Also, looking through the tiny hole in the end cap with a bright light, I can see spring coils that go all the way to the interior end of the cap. Thanks much, Howard

What is the title of Bruce's new book?

Flinging brass that far is about right. Some well-worn M1941s or guns with weak recoil springs can have a violent action and can endanger shooters on the far right of the line! Sounds like maybe your gun doesn't need the recoil spring replaced, but it's an easy job. Remove the bolt, then the butt plate. Under the butt plate you'll see the steel slotted recoil spring retaining plug, which is also the buffer. Unscrew and remove it, and pull out the spring and plunger, which are now loose. While you're at it, now's a good opportunity to lube the spring and plunger before reassembly. I use Lubriplate. Hope that this helps!

This rifle has been refinished, without doubt. It looks to be a very nice job! I lucked into a M1941 JSAR in original virtually new condition years ago, and have noticed the following differences between it and most refurbished guns: The bolt handle and extractor were originally blued, along with the ejector and its spring. Most of the rear sight was painted black, which is flaking off of most original rifles today. The adjusting knob was parked, as was the aperture itself. The cavity inside of the receiver in which the bolt rides should be bright, with evidence of milling. As others have already stated, originally each parked piece had a slightly different color and finish to it. The visible portion of the bolt should be bright. Serial numbers should not match. The wood was originally finish sanded using belt sanders and will generally show minute transverse scratches from sanding cross-wise to the grain. Many (if not most) M1941 butt stocks will show laminations at the magazine swell. These stocks will also have holes for lightening and storage under the butt plates, which reproduction stocks generally will not have. The original stocks had factory markings on the flat face of the magazine swell. These guns have generally been restored and refurbished because they need it. Many were completely worn out before refurbishing. A nice M1941 (even a refinished one) will have a slick, tight feel to it, not loose and wobbly. A range visit will likely tell the tale. If you have the opportunity to shoot the rifle you will quickly notice whether or not it's accurate. (You're looking for accuracy that's acceptable for military purposes, not a MOA tack driver.) A violent action that flings damaged cases a long way is another indicator of wear, or might only mean that the recoil spring (in the tube in the butt stock) needs to be replaced. The action should cycle gently, piling cases just a few feet to the right. Shooters at the other end of the line should not be in danger of injury from your brass. The gun should function reliably with M2 ball ammunition, and should compare favorably with a service grade M1 Garand. (Yes, it's legal for use in 100 yd. John C. Garand service rifle matches.) Is the barrel original? Does it have original JA (edit) and Netherlands Purchasing Comission marks? (Many if not most refurbished gus have been rebarreled.) How's the chamber? If it's rough, failures to extract are virtually certain to happen regularly. I'm no expert. I've seen many M1941 JSARs, but I've only owned one of them. It's a very nice example, though. It has none of the problems mentioned above. It has almost all of its original finish, and it's reliable, accurate, and a real pleasure to shoot. Hope that this helps!

Photo? None of the 1942 era photographs that I've seen (many) show anything like this. The manuals and few available authoritative books don't mention any accessories for a modification like this. I know of no originally produced blank firing attachment. Others here will know better than I.

About three months ago now, I tried to have a replacement butt stock made for my M1941 and chanced upon the web site below. The owner, Randall ("Randy") Murray, said that he could certainly handle the job. The stock was made and sent, but there were problems which made the stock unusable. The spring tube inletting was nowhere near right. It turns out that Murray's has never actually made a M1941 butt stock that was not returned. I sent mine back as well. I requested a refund, but this has not been forthcoming as Randy says "he's a little short" right now. You might want to steer clear of this business. The good news is that Joe Scott produces a very nice repro butt stock, so I need not have bothered with looking elsewhere in the first place! http://murraysgunstocks.com/

Yes, and since the recoil tube inletting is integral to the design and proper functioning of the gun, "close" just won't cut it!

Could someone kindly post or PM a phone number for Joe Scott? I need to buy a M1941 butt stock. Thanks! Howard

Bought one of Joe Scott's stocks. It arrived today. It's a lovely hunk of wood, military straight grained walnut and not "skinny" at all. Thanks, Joe! Howard

Hello! Does anyone have a production drawing of the M1941 JSAR butt stock that they might be willing to share? I'm trying to make a really accurate reproduction. Thanks!

The effort described above finally arrived but it was a disaster. The maker was clueless about the stock's interior inletting, especially for the spring tube. The stock had to be returned. I don't believe the maker has an original stock or an accurate pattern from which to work.

Thanks, Joe.

Canfield's book, p. 112, has photos of his new condition factory presentation M1941. Its sight elevating slide has these markings. The same slide is shown again in detail on p. 93. Every slide in the entire book would appear to be so marked, except for those on the the prototypes and pre-production models.

These are original factory markings. They were painted in white, but have yellowed with age. I'll go rummaging around on my book shelf to see if I can find a proper reference.

Hello, What is meant by "stock type" or "stock type #2" when applied to the M1941? Is that in reference to a stock with or without laminations present? Thanks! Howard

Thank goodness Winfield didn't grind off the forward swivel mounts on the receivers!

We don't know the proportion of laminated to solid butt stocks, but it sounds like it wouldn't stretch belief at all for any "later" (B series) M1941 to have a solid stock. All we can say today is that a M1941 is more likely to have been produced with a laminated stock, but either can be quite correct. To further cloud the issue, Canfield states that M1941 serial number production was not sequential. A rifle with a B series serial number was not necessarily manufactured later than one with an A series number. It looks like our normal frame of reference as collectors regarding serial numbers doesn't apply with JSARs. So, why am I going to so much trouble to produce an accurate reproduction M1941 butt stock that includes the laminations and lightening/storage cavities? Simple. No one else has done it.

Has anyone noticed other Winfield Sporters with markings like these?

I think Bruce Canfield has probably written the definitive history on these rifles so far, Johnson Rifles and Machine guns; The Story of Melvin Maynard Johnson, Jr., and His Guns. It's a good read and a worthy addition to any book shelf. A few pertainent passages from page 252, "Collector notes": "The chief reason for the laminated wood . . . was that it enabled narrower (2-inch) stock blanks to be used." "Some original Johnson stocks did not have the laminated wood which indicates that thicker wood blanks (3-inch) were used. While "solid" stocks were used on some original Johnson rifles, the laminated stocks are the most commonly encountered variety. Collectors today should realize, however, that most of the reproduction Johnson stocks, including the stocks used by Winfield Arms, do not have the laminated area. There does not appear to be any specific time frame or serial number range for original Johnson rifles that left the factory with the laminated stocks or solid stocks. The use of both varieties seems to have been interspersed during production and was likely a case of using whatever size of stock blanks that were on hand."

Thanks for the clarification! Howard

I occasionally need a spare part. I do not want it to differ from the original specification, nor should it be incomplete or marked as a fake. Those two extra holes under the butt plate were for lightening and for the storage of spare parts. No reproduction M1941 butt stock is complete without them. An original "B" series JSAR will have almost always have the three piece laminated butt stock. It's a PIA to get that little touch right, but well worth it. It was done in the photos above by rough milling the blank and then trimming it until it was a precise 2" in thickness. The laminations were glued in place, and then that portion of the stock was rough milled again. The laminations and inletting came out perfectly. Have decided against trying to secure the original butt stock production drawings. A far better option is to use an original M1941 butt stock that's in excellent unmolested condition for the pattern. That's what we're doing. The next effort is due out this week and I'll post photos of it. It should be very nearly perfect and almost indistinguishable from a new condition original. I will not add the original markings, though this could be very easly done as they're so simple in nature.

I'm thinking probably not as they were proprietary. Just schematics. I figured that you would have these if anyone did!